‘Modern Love Podcast:’ That Time I Bought My Husband’s Girlfriend a Burial Plot

This transcript was created using speech recognition software. While it has been reviewed by human transcribers, it may contain errors. Please review the episode audio before quoting from this transcript and email [email protected] with any questions.

Hey, everyone, it’s Anna. Before we get started today, I just want to ask a quick favor. We’re working on our Valentine’s Day episode. And we want you to be a part of it. Can you tell us about the moment you knew you were falling in love? Where were you? What was happening? What did it feel like? It can be about a relationship you’re currently in, or a relationship from the past. We just want to know about the moment you could tell, hey, I’m falling in love with this person.

Record your answer as a voice memo and email it to [email protected], and we may end up featuring it on the show. One more time, tell us about the moment you knew you were falling in love, and send it as a voice memo to [email protected]. We are so excited to hear from you. If you want to be included in the episode, your deadline is February 5. OK, let’s start the show.

Robin Eileen Bernstein did not like calling herself a widow.

So when it came time to write the inscription for her husband’s headstone, Robin was stumped.

What happens when the permanence of death clashes with the messiness of life? From “The New York Times,” I’m Anna Martin. This is “Modern Love.” Each week, we bring you stories inspired by the “Modern Love” column. Today’s episode is based on an essay called, “Here Lie the Bickersons, Side by Side for all Eternity,” by Robin Eileen Bernstein. Stick with us.

[SOFT MUSIC]

Robin Eileen Bernstein, welcome to “Modern Love.”

Anna, I’m so happy to be here. Thank you.

I’m going to jump right in with you. Why did you and your husband Mark, decide to get divorced?

We had a long marriage, but there was a lot of bickering. Every couple argues, right? But for us, I think the balance was like, the arguing to the good times was —

The ratio was off.

The ratio was off. We agreed on the big stuff. We wanted kids. We had two kids within four years. We enjoyed doing the same things. We had similar worldviews. But Mark was — he kind had this sort of “my way or the highway” approach to life. And he felt like he knew the best way to do things, go to this supermarket or drive in this — take that route. For example, the grocery store —

So I had just moved out to Long Island, which was where he lived. I had been living in Manhattan. And I didn’t really — I was having trouble adjusting to living out there. It wasn’t for me. So he was telling me where the grocery stores were. That’s the store. He pointed to one grocery store. That’s the store you should go to.

And I didn’t particularly like going to that grocery store. I liked the other one, a mile the other direction. But he was so insistent. Well, they have the best prices or they have the best this. And it just — that’s the level of small stuff we’re talking about. Or we’d be driving, and he was a backseat driver. Oh, pass that car. Oh, you should go that way, it’s a little quicker. It’s like, you drive then.

He wasn’t an easy person. He could be a very difficult person. He had a good heart. And it was coming from a good place. He thought he was spreading his wisdom.

Helping, yeah.

He thought he was helping, exactly. Thank you. And when you’re living with someone like that day in and day out, it’s just exhausting because I had my own opinions. And it became apparent early on in the marriage. I mean, we started marriage counseling right after our honeymoon. And we continued with counseling for a good chunk of our marriage. And I was reading every — I’d go to Barnes and Noble and read every “how to save your marriage” book, or then, when the internet came along, Googling.

What kinds of questions were you Googling?

How to communicate better, a lot about how to get along, just the day-to-day stuff, and not argue about every little thing. And I think he would try to change. And we both wanted the marriage to work. I thought of it like, you when you’re in the ocean and a wave comes and knocks you down? And you get up. And then another wave comes and knocks you down. And then you get up. And then after a hundred times getting knocked down, it’s like, this is exhausting and I think —

I want to get out of the ocean.

Yeah.

Who was Robin before she met Mark? What was her life like?

So I was living in Manhattan, in the West Village. I had this great apartment. And I was a drummer in a band.

Hey, hold on. You were a drummer in a band?

I was a drummer in a band. So I was living this kind of fun city life. It was just fun. And then I meet Mark, and now my life is — that life is —

Yeah.

I did want a partner. I wanted to get married very much. And I wanted kids. But I don’t think I fully realized how much I was giving up.

Tell me, what drew you to him initially?

He was this really spontaneous guy. He had two speeds. He was running, doing, or he was on the couch with the remote. We were at the beach one day. And suddenly he starts putting on his clothes, his shorts and his — I’m like, where are we going? He goes, we’re going to the movies. He just had all this energy. And I just got swept into that. But he made me feel very loved. And he was extremely —

How? Did he say it?

Oh my god, he had a phrase — now it escapes me — but something he would say. Oh, I remember. He would say, I’m lovesick. That’s what he would say, I’m lovesick. I felt wanted.

That’s so powerful.

I felt really wanted. And I had had a lot of years of dating, and relationships not working out. And it’s like, here is this guy. And it just seemed to be working. And he seemed crazy about me. And he was there. And it was moving in the right direction. And I probably noticed, OK, maybe it’s not perfect —

But what is?

— but what is. It’s like, it’s pretty good. You know the biggest problem, I think, with the two of us? Was we were attracted to each other. We had the physical attraction. We had similar interests. We both wanted a family. So we did have a lot of the big things in common. But at the core, we weren’t really friends. We loved each other, but we didn’t necessarily always like each other. We were like just two good people who weren’t good together. I was a Mac and he was a PC.

And we were just — two different operating systems.

Were you the Mac? Or were you the PC?

I was the Mac —

OK. Thank goodness. I was like —

He was —

You look like a Mac to me.

So that’s one of the reasons that the marriage failed, was this just constant stress of trying to understand each other, trying to get each other, and not being able to.

Yeah, I guess I wonder, was there a moment where you were like, this is too much, I’m done? Or was it like a rolling boil, almost like, since you got back from the honeymoon?

I think for a long time, I thought we could fix this. It was just a matter of finding the right counselor or the right —

Or the right book, yeah.

— the right book, whatever. By the last few years, it wasn’t if we’re going to split up, it was more like when. I think I did say to him, maybe we should split up, this isn’t going to work. And he’d say, no, we’re going to work it out. He wanted it to work. I was the more realistic one, although ironically, he was the one who actually pulled the plug before I did.

Really? He said, let’s —

He said — it was a regular day. I was walking out the door. I was going somewhere. And I passed by him. He was sitting on the couch, watching TV. And I said, bye, I’m headed out or whatever. And he said, oh, OK. And by the way, you’re going to be getting a letter from my attorney.

Robin.

It was just so matter of fact, like, oh, by the way, go pick up a quart of milk. Oh, by the way, you’re going to get a letter from my attorney. And I remember stopping and thinking, OK, oh, so this is how it ends.

It’s striking me that you two did not bicker about getting a divorce. It sounds like that was something that you both —

It was a relief. It was a relief, I think, to finally just —

to stop trying so hard.

The thing about — well, not that I’ve been divorced, but so I’m told — is that it’s tough, it can be ugly, it can drag on, especially when kids are in the mix. How did it work with you two?

It was slow. Once we agreed to split up, I just figured, OK, you come to an agreement about finances and who gets what, and then that’s it. But it just kept dragging on and on. But on the flip side, because there was a sense of relief, we were in this Twilight Zone, where OK, this isn’t so bad. It became comfortable to just live apart and not go through the actual nuts and bolts of the actual divorce.

So you’re living apart after 17 years. What does that do for your dynamic?

It took the pressure off of us. We were still legally married. We didn’t have a formal separation agreement. It was just like, OK, you do your thing, I’ll do my thing. It was like, oh, you want to come over and see the kids? Whatever. We were now able to communicate without this constant bickering.

Did you two start to date other people?

Yeah. Well, he met someone quickly.

How did that feel?

It was fine. You know what? Because it was like, she took him off my hands.

A terrible thing to say, but he loves this new person. And he said, you’ll like her, too. And I was happy that he found someone else and that he was happier and calmer because it made my life easier.

Tell me about when you first met her. And did you like her as much as Mark said you would?

I did. She was very sweet. She had a nice smile. She seemed very warm and friendly, not standoffish and aloof or anything like that. I liked her.

As you started to spend more time with the girlfriend and with Mark, did you see that kind of friction between the two of them, that kind of bickering that you two had? Or was it smoother?

It was smoother. But I will tell you this. There was one point when she said to me, he could be kind of difficult.

And you were like, sister —

I was like, just — I wanted to say, this is a no-return policy.

No refunds, no returns.

You’re like, I’m sorry, you threw away the receipt.

Right, right, right. I mean, she was aware of it, too.

Yeah.

But I think that they were hoping to — once Mark and I finalized our divorce, I think the assumption was that they would get engaged and married.

Are all of you spending time together as a family? What about holidays?

So we continued to spend holidays together for the most part. His brother and his brother’s wife, so my brother-in-law and sister-in-law, they lived nearby. And they tended to have holidays at their house. And I continued to be invited. I mean, I was still part of the family, which was wonderful for me. It was, because that’s not always the case. It’s like, you split up, goodbye, you’re dead to me. We never want to see you again. I mean, his family loved me. They were like, we want her.

We like her grocery store — It’s

Right. It’s like, who gets who? It’s like, we don’t want him. We want her. So anyway, I was at some holiday dinner at their house, with a lot of people. Mark and his girlfriend and me and the kids and my brother-in-law and sister-in-law and their kids, and then extended family, other cousins and friends —

The whole gang’s here.

— the whole gang. And we’re all having coffee and dessert. And people were getting ready to go home. And Mark got up, and he stood behind his girlfriend, and he put his hands on her shoulders, and said, OK, honey, it’s time to go. And then I was sitting next to her. So then he moved over, and did the same thing. He puts his hands on my shoulder and said, OK, honey, it’s time to go.

And everybody just cracked up.

I love that.

It was like, he took a moment that could have been tense — I mean, it is odd to have the girlfriend and the wife there.

Still wife, yeah, the divorce is still —

I was still the wife. I mean, it’s unusual. And he just diffused it. He could be very funny if he wanted to be. And it was just such a great moment. It was so funny and so real.

Did it make you feel even more so like, this is right? This is the decision that had to be made?

It did. It was like, this is going to work. He’s going to eventually marry her. And I’ll be able to move back to the city, where I want to be, and all will be good.

[SOFT MUSIC]

Just as Robin was getting comfortable with the situation, everything suddenly changed. That’s when we come back. Stay with us.

[SOFT MUSIC]

Tell me about the last time you saw Mark.

Sure. It was a beautiful Sunday afternoon. And I was in the backyard. And he called and said, can I come over and hang with the kids? He had been away that weekend, with a buddy of his. And I said, sure. I joked. I said, you can come in and vacuum out the pool. So he came over. And we had a little basketball thing set up in the driveway. I remember he was shooting hoops with the kids.

We sat around the pool. We talked. I don’t remember the details, but I remember it being a lovely afternoon, where we were not arguing, and thinking that, had it been like this more often during our marriage, that maybe we would have stayed together.

And then around 4 o’clock, I was sitting in a chair outside. And I was reading. And I heard him say, I’m leaving.

Did you hug goodbye?

No, we didn’t. We didn’t hug goodbye. I just remember hearing him say, I’m leaving. And those were the last words I ever heard him say, I’m leaving — because that was the night he had a heart attack.

[SOFT MUSIC]

Tell me about how you found that out.

It was in the evening after dinner. And I was watching TV in my room. And his girlfriend called.

And that’s when she told me he had a heart attack. And she was a nurse. She did CPR on him, she said. And she called 911. And the ambulance came, but it took them, I think, close to 40 minutes to get a normal sinus rhythm back. So that’s too long. And so he was now in the ER. And she said, come quickly.

And how old was he at that time?

57. So he was young.

Yeah.

I’ve got the kids. The three of us get in the car. And we drive to the hospital. And it was a Sunday night. It was very quiet there. And there was this ER attendant. I guess he was like a security guard. So I walk in, and I said who we were there to see. And he said, oh, well — he ushers us into this waiting room. And he said, well, you guys are going to have to wait in here because the doctor is talking to the family.

And you were like —

Because his girlfriend was there. And also, it turns out my brother-in-law had just gotten there, too. So I said, well, we are the family. And he looks at me and he goes, who are you?

And I said, I’m his wife and these are his kids. The look on his face was like, this can’t be good. I mean, I wish I had taken a picture of his face because it was just like, what? Who’s that lady in there?

Did you explain? OK, you were just like, let’s get in there.

Yeah. So yeah, then I’m ushered into the room with the doctor. And one of the ICU nurses said to me at one point, when we found out there was a wife and a girlfriend, we were all, prepared for — and they were so pleased to see how well everybody got along.

Wow.

We’re in a terrible situation to begin with. And there was no reason to make it worse. And I also felt for his girlfriend. I mean, I thought, this has to be so awkward for her. I just wanted her to not feel like I’m elbowing her out, like hey, get out of the way, I’m the wife now. You’re not needed here.

And emotionally, she is, I’m sure, distraught as well, right?

Oh, she’s very — I mean, he had a heart attack in front of her. She was the one dealing. I mean, I’m sitting home, watching HBO. And I’m the wife. And she’s the girlfriend, who doesn’t have a legal bond to him. And yet, she’s the one who’s really suffering. It just — partly, I felt like, what am I doing here? Because remember, we were separated for two years at that point. We had not been together for two years. He’s with her. I’m dating. I refer to him as my ex.

So now suddenly, I’m the wife? That’s what kind of blew my mind. It’s like, we are leading separate lives, we have divorce attorneys, and now suddenly, everyone’s treating me like, well, you’re the wife, you’re in charge. You’re the health-care proxy. You’re the mother of the children. And everyone’s kind of looking at me.

Once it was clear that Mark was not going to recover, what did you decide to do?

We decided to take him off life support because they said there’s no hope. There’s very little brain function. So I had to get a burial plot. We didn’t have burial plots. We’d never spoke about it. We had other issues we were dealing with. And my sister-in-law said to me, well, why don’t you buy two plots, one for Mark and one for his girlfriend? And I just I looked at her, and I thought — I looked at her like she was crazy because I thought, she’ll meet somebody else.

I didn’t say this, but I’m thinking, why would she — it’s not like she’s Ms. Havisham from “Great Expectations,” she’s going to be in her wedding dress with cobwebs for the next 50 years. I mean, she’ll have a life. And I thought about it. And I thought, well, if it helps her to feel included, OK, fine. And I went over, and I said, I’m going to get two burial plots. And if you want one, you want a plot? Here’s a free burial plot. I don’t remember exactly how I said it to her, but she immediately burst in — said thank you. She burst into these happy tears or emotional tears. I think she appreciated this gesture of inclusion.

Tell me about when you went to the cemetery to buy these plots. And what happened?

It was Friday morning. And he was being taken off life support that afternoon. So I basically had just a few hours to get this burial plot. And I met my brother-in-law at the cemetery —

His brother, Mark’s brother.

Mark’s brother, yes. And we go into a sales office, I guess. It’s like a regular office with a big desk. And the sales guy for the cemetery is sitting on the other side. And I explained. I told him the situation. He’s on life support. He’s not expected to survive. So I want to buy two plots. So the sales guy expresses his condolences. And he said, I assume you’ll want a double stone.

So I said, well, the other plot isn’t for me, it’s for his girlfriend.

He’s like — his eyebrows go up into his to the top of his head. And he’s like, OK. He looks to my brother-in-law because he’s thinking, I’m dealing with a crazy wife.

So my brother-in-law said, well, they were getting divorced. At that point, the sales guy is kind of — you can see him shuffling papers. And he’s thinking — I imagine the thought bubble on his head is like, OK, if this wife wants to buy a burial plot for the guy she’s divorcing and his girlfriend, not my problem.

It was really so —

But you did it.

I did it. I bought the two plots.

But then you have to figure out, obviously, what to write for Mark. How did you figure that out?

That was not easy. I wanted to reflect the relationship that we had, not the relationship that everyone would assume because normally, it would say beloved husband. And that would come at the top, and then father, brother, whatever. So this was — can I take —

Pulling out a paper. Yeah, Yeah, yeah.

At the top, it says, loving father, because that was his most important role, caring husband, devoted son because his dad was still alive, dear brother and uncle, and then for his girlfriend at the bottom, beloved companion. It’s interesting because someone told me years later, that “companion” means your pet.

I was going to say, it sounds kind of like a dog.

Yeah, and I was like, oh, jeez. And it’s kind of too late to change.

You’re like, it’s literally written in stone.

Right. It’s literally written in stone. Well, I just thought, beloved boyfriend, especially when you have caring husband, I don’t know.

I think that covers the bases.

Yeah, it was like, what? Companion and husband? OK. I could have written soon-to-be ex-husband. Maybe that would have been better.

As the years passed, did the idea of Mark’s girlfriend being buried next to Mark still seemed like the right thing for everyone?

We stayed in touch the first year or two. We definitely stayed in touch, especially on birthdays or on the anniversary of the death. We invited her to dinners, things like that. But then as time went on, you just start to move on with your life. And by the time — I had to pay off the cemetery in 36 monthly installments. So it was three years before I finally got the deed to the plots. So by the time I got the deed in the mail, I was living back in Manhattan.

Were you still in touch with the girlfriend by that point?

Not that much at that point, no. It was like, am I supposed to email her and say, hey, I got the deed? It’s three years later. Are you still interested? The whole thing just was bizarre. But I found out through the grapevine that she had gotten married. And I texted her saying, congratulations, I heard you got married. That’s when she texted back, thank you. And how are the kids? And I miss you guys. It was really warm.

That was five years ago. And I guess that was the point when I realized, well, clearly she doesn’t want this burial plot, right. It’s like, Hi, I know you’re remarried, but are you still interested in being buried next to him?

It’s not the time to bring it up now.

Yeah.

But that doesn’t answer the question of, well, so what do you do? I mean, you have it. You own it.

I own it.

You’ve paid it off.

Well, right. Here’s what I wrestle with. I wrestle with, do you get buried next to the guy you were divorcing? That’s number one. And then the other question is, I never wanted to live out there and never really wanted to leave the city and never wanted to move to the suburbs. So it’s like, well, why would I want to spend eternity there, buried next to the guy who all we did was bicker? It was like, well —

So it sounds like you very much still — the short version of it is, you still don’t know what you’re going to do with this plot.

I still could sell it. But the fact that I have not done a thing kind of means that I made a decision, just by not making a decision.

What does that tell you? Yeah, what does that tell you?

It tells me that — it doesn’t make any sense on a lot of levels, but on a lot of levels, it does make sense for me to be there because where else would I be? I’ll be dead. What am I trying to prove?

You said in life, Mark really wanted things his way. And I think it’ll be funny in a dark way, but in a funny way, if he gets his way and you end up on Long Island after all.

That’s so perceptive. He’s still getting his way. Even in death, he’s still getting his —

[LAUGHS]

I did not want to move out there. When we got engaged, I used to say to him, I’m moving back to the city. You’re either coming with me or you’re not. But now he’s dragging —

He’s dragging you back.

He’s dragging me back, and this time, forever.

If you end up buried next to Mark on that cemetery on Long Island, which it sounds like you might —

Many, many, many years from now.

Many years. Oh, my god, so many.

So many years.

What do you think he would say? Like, he’d roll over and be like, Robin, you’re here.

Where did you go shopping?

How much did you pay for lettuce?

Take a right turn.

How much did you pay for lettuce? It’s cheaper at the other place.

I was going to say, I’m dead, but that’s not the right —

That’s it.

That’s so funny.

Yeah, we’ll just be bickering into eternity about, I don’t like those flowers. Get a different plant. It’s just, yeah, it —

Have you been out to visit Mark recently?

Yes, I was out there a few times. Most recently was sometime last year. And I went over and just kind of looked at him, and talked to him, and told him what was up. And then I looked at the space next to him and thought, is that really where I’m going to end up?

And how did you feel, looking at that empty space?

It felt strange. It felt really strange because I always wondered if buying that plot for his girlfriend was really just a way of — that maybe it was for me all along, getting divorced or not. We struggled so hard to make this marriage work. And then we actually did split up. But we never really split up. It’s like we split up, but we were still married. And then he died. So I feel like I’ve spent my entire time with him, before he died and after, trying to split up.

Splitting up is hard. Sometimes it takes forever.

Robin, thank you so much for this conversation. We talked about death so much, and still somehow, it was a blast.

And we’re still laughing.

We’re laughing.

Anna, it was such a pleasure speaking to you about this.

Thank you so much.

You’re very welcome. Thank you. [SOFT MUSIC]

This episode of “Modern Love” was produced by Amy Pearl with help from Reva Goldberg and Davis Land. It was edited by our executive producer Jen Poyant, production management by Kristina Djossa. The “Modern Love” theme music is by Dan Powell. Original music by Rowan Niemisto. Aman Sahota, and Marion Lozano. This episode was mixed by Daniel Ramirez. Studio support from Maddy Masiello and Nick Pitman. Special thanks to Mahima Chablani, Nell Gallogly, Jeffrey Miranda, and Paula Szuchman.

The “Modern Love” column is edited by Daniel Jones. Miya Lee is the editor of “Modern Love” projects. If you want to submit an essay or a tiny love story to “The New York Times,” we’ve got the instructions in our show notes. I’m Anna Martin. Thanks for listening.